Saturday, June 30, 2012
Dear AA: How Do I Hate You, Let Me Count the Ways
I just stumbled out of an AA meeting in tears. Why was I there in the first place? Because my NP asked me to go, and I would do anything she asked me to do, even if it was jump off a building. Unfortunately, she won't ask me to jump off a building.
I'm trying, I really am, but i juat hate AA, I hate AA, I hate AA, I hate AA. Do you get the impression that I hate AA? Good.
What, you might ask, do I hate about AA? It might be simpler to ask me what I like about AA.
Just take today's meeting as an example. I showed up all showered and shaved and nicely dressed. And there were all these aging Bikers, people in tee-shirts, tank tops and shorts. Waterville definitely needs a better class of alcoholic.
Everyone was all happy, milling about, waving, socializing, saying hi, shaking hands, making small talk, smiling. . . being happy. I just found a chair in the farthest corner pressed my hands between my knees, turned my face down and did my best to bite back the tears that were already starting to come.
It was just like being back in elementary school.
I hated elementary school.
The meeting got off to a start and as has happened more than once or twice before at these affairs I couldn't hear or understand a damn thing the main speaker was sayng. Mumble mumble mumble. Fortunately or unfortunately, he soon passed it off to a guy who knew how to speak to a room.
I have to say "unfortunately" because the first ten minutes of an AA meeting are always the same. You always get the Commercial Message about How Great AA is and how all you have to do is follow the Twelve Steps. That would be (barely) tolerable. But the writers of the Dogma (and it is Dogma, no matter how you slice it -- AA is a CULT, folks, pure and simple) had to go one step further and dump all over people for whom AA doesn't work. Every meeting I go to, I have to listen to what a sad, worthless failure of a person I am because AA just simply Isn't Working for me.
Well, from there they recite the Twelve Steps and here is the heaviest dose of AA hypocrisy on the meeting's menu, because if you ask any one of them they will tell you, "It's not about God, it's not about God," but dang it all, it's RIGHT THERE in the Twelve Steps and it BLOODY WELL IS ABOUT GOD. Anyone who tells you otherwise is giving you a snow job.
God is everywhere in AA and the meetings are even structured like church meetings.
I do not believe in God. And if I ever came face to face with that low-down SOB I would first punch him on the nose and then strangle him, not just for what he's done to me, but for what he's done, or allowed to be done to so many innocent people over so many millennia. So much pain, all in the name of a bloody evil god who obviously hates us all.
And to you, CD, my NP, whom I think the world of, even you said to me, "God doesn't make crap."
Well, yeah he does. I'll just say "George Bush" and stop right there.
Anyway. Back to the meeting.
Around this time, a woman that I actually know, used to work with, and have had some issues with in the past, walked in, late. There were no chairs. I gave her mine, and from a close side room pulled out another and sat at the farthest edge of the room. The preliminaries over, the man running the meeting took over, and once again it was mumble mumble mumble. There were words and the litany of responses but when you can't understand what's being said you can't be expected to join in on their cultlike behaviour. I caught S_____'s eye and gestured at my ear; she shook her head.
I was so frustrated. I thought, It's just plain rude to waste people's time like this. After several minutes had passed, I got up and slipped into the next room. There were windows looking out out onto the street, and across to the hospital where I'd spent the last week.
And suddenly I was sobbing. I went and buried myself in the farthest corner of the room where I hoped that I couldn't be heard in the meeting. There was laughter and applause from the next room, and I thought, That's another Universe in there, that's not something I can ever be a part of.
Eventually, I calmed down to the point where I could go quickly out the back way, There's no sneaking out of one of these meetings, or I would have snuck.
My favorite AA story is one that I heard at one of the small AA meetings held at 4 East this last time. The guy running it was one of the Biker AA types. He mentioned that he had three sponsors when he started with the group. And oh, by the way -- they're all Stone Dead now. So AA really doesn't work so well for a lot of people, does it?
I want a solution as much as anyone. But why is everyone married to AA as the only solution? Isn't there anything else out there? Something with a little less Jim Jones, a little less Elementary School and a lot less Jesus? It's just like what I was trying to say to that snaggle-toothed bag of bones Romper Room OT teacher before she officiously "corrected" me: we're not all cut out of the same cookie mold. If it works for you, I'm HAPPY for you. But stop insisting that it's the only hope for me. 'Cuz I do need hope, I sure do. But it's got to come from somewhere else.
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I hear ya, to be honest I don't have a drinking problem I just had a problem while drinking. I drink about 3-4 times a year, and got into a fight with a guy with a martini in my hand. I won the fight, I go to jail. I sit in these things thinking "Well, I'll quit drinking just not to turn out like you guys."ReplyDelete
I understand it works for some, and that's great, but it's not a blanket treatment. Court mandated AA is really a joke, and being forced to socialize with these people (you can't ignore them forever, unfortunately) makes me resent the whole process.
I wont be giving a sponsor my home phone or cell phone number. It's Anonymous, I don't even want you saying "Hello" to me in public. It's OK that they have a problem, but I can't relate to anything said in there. They speak of alcohol like I would speak of cigarettes.
More power to the people it helps, but IMO you're just trading one addiction for another -- in this case AA.
I hear you loud and clear on this one. i have been at AA recovery for 1372 days consecutive. the kinda day I had in life and in the rooms was enough to make me NOT drink. I dont know but I hate AA most days cuz I think I know better and to be honest I am angry fearful self loathing no self esteem misfit who drank at 24yrsold cuz i wanted a life and to stop the anxiety attacks. Needless to say 23 years later I am so called so and now on my 4th sponsor id love to can. Its tough:the AA way or the highway. I tend to believe ppl are just born messed up so let me do my thing which is slow death. I cant drink and never should of but honestly life was always a mess for me. I have some money no legal charges on me and i dont frequent bars and drink. Of course its a loose cult and it trades one addiction for another. Im gonna stick around and watch "me" get pummeled again by AA. I wish all of you well. this 3rd AA year has sucked!Delete
A.A. Clearly states in their literature that "We do not hold the monopoly on getting clean and sober, but we have found a way that works". Everyone in A.A seems to believe that if Bill W. tried it first and it didn't work then it simply must not work. Not true!! Their are all sorts of ways that people get clean and sober and stay that way. First one must decide they really do want to stop for themselves and not for anyone else.The 12 steps are a great laid out format for repairing the past and moving on with the future. Sadly most want to just do the "meeting makers make it" way and that is a program of "no action!!" Going to meetings and not taking action for the "problem" that surely warrants your attention is a sure way of returning to "active use" which only compounds the problem. If A.A. is not for you I encourage you to find something/some other way that is a good fit which helps direct you back to a way of living that allows you The "POWER" to make good , rational decisions about your life and not continue to give that power to the bottle, the bag, the needle, the relationship etc... Make the decision , take action and the changes, sometimes quickly,sometimes slowly will come. The key is to never give up !!!! Best wishes my friend !!Delete
I am not an alcoholic, but was married to one. When he was begining his recovery, I went to several AA meetings as well as CODA meetings.ReplyDelete
AA IS a God-based program. I am too rational to believe in God (or his friends, the "higher powers"). To me AA is just another variety of religion - dogmatic, ritualistic, faith-based organization, insisting on the "powerlessness" of its members against addiction. This very simplistic mindset works for some, but it fails more than it saves. Still, it does save some, so I suppose it is worth a shot for those seeking help.
What I find really irksome, trite and silly are the new navel-gazing AA bloggers - the "Rah-rah, I am so glad I am sober today and my life is a long series of t-shirt slogans" kind of blogger. While they might inspire a few people to try to get sober, mostly they just degrade themselves, often revealing that they are still hopelessly insecure, anxious wild-cannons.
AA does not make you wise and wonderful - for some it helps them get sober. There are other ways, paths to greater self-awareness, wisdom, and temperance. I know I would not be happy to wake up every morning and have to feel that any day I could slip up, fall back into addiction. The pervasive idea that once you are addict, you are always an addict, is just not universally true. Shouldn't people be striving for a self that is not a drink away from failure, from destruction?
A program based on a God, and personal powerlessness, a precarious daily balance, and a life-long need for that same program...it really seems to fall short of what we should want for addicts - for anyone - doesn't it?
The AA big book will solve all Life's Problems: What a HoaxReplyDelete
Bullshit! AA and the AA book is solving the problem of alcoholism by giving long term sobriety to alcoholics at a 2 - 3% success rate. All the other boozers go back to drinking. An honest alcoholic in AA who is in the 2 to 3% of those who have long term sobriety will maybe admit to that fact. To quote the big book "Lets look at the record".
The two most common characteristics you will find in an Alcoholic in AA are 1) Extremism and 2) Insanity. When I listen to these people in an AA meeting I think to myself, "God these alkies make al-Qaeda look like moderates". They are so hardcore about their beliefs and ideas, and everybody outside of AA is "an Earth Person". Now to AA's neurosis, psychosis, and all together fucked up shit. Wow, I didn't know people could get this crazy. Damn, I didn't know people could get this screwed up and still be alive. Its like they have been mauled, or mauled someone else, shot some body or shot themselves, and lived through it all. No wonder they drink. Jesus Christ you are going to need something to get you through life if your that messed up.
To sum up, I will quote their silly little book again. "If you want what we have..." This one is really laughable. Who on earth would want what an alcoholic has. Would someone want to be so crazy, so confused, so misguided and messed up as an AA alcoholic who has not had a drink in a while. Its like if you went to a meeting with suffering cancer patients and one of them got up and said "If you want the hellish cancer I have". No body in their right mind wants that.
I love that one, "if you want what we have." I got the living shit beat out of me by a cult member, under the "bullshit guise" of "constructive criticism." That's the biggest oxymorn of an abuser that I've ever heard! You can't tear another person apart and call it 'constructive.' Lots of luck to those people walking around with medallion's around their necks, talking like the programmed automaton's out of that old movie: Stepford Wives. If that's what you want, all that I have to offer you is something that I made up out of Allison in Wonderland: "A very happy un-drunk day, to you, to you, a very happy church basement day, and toodle loo.' (ha)Delete
Thanks to all three of the people who posted comments. I'm always grateful when folks stop by this blog for any reason. I have to wonder, if it concerned itself with anything other than alcoholism, would AA even be tolerated in our culture? Certainly many if not most of the non-alcoholics who routinely point to AA as the answer would never normally support such a cultlike organization.ReplyDelete
For my part, in the four months that have passed since I wrote this post, I have given up AA completely, and I am doing fine in life. By not making addiction the be-all and end-all of my existence, the way AA forces its members to do, my addiction is much easier to manage. That -- and they finally found what appears to be the right combination of drugs to manage my depression.
treatment for depression is a big part of the puzzle for many people addicted to alcohol and drugs.
aa helped me stop drinking. In hindight having the support of the fellowship while my brain recovered from active addiction was of value. But now i am sober over four years and not drinking is not hard anymore.
i have been looking around at how sick folks are and planning on dumping aa. But i have met a lot of nice people along the way that are not nazis. I am in so cal however and there are many different meetings.
but the parroted dogma gets old and there is much more to life than talking about not ddrinking. Good luck on your journey. I hope you find the healing that is right for you.
Thank you... A A got me off drugs started june 2013. Iv drank a few times and even enjoyed it nothing bad happened. Im now 2 years sober and AA in my area is some nice people with long term sobrity however when u get to really know them u find out how screwed up there lifes really are thay just dont drink... I know principles before personality s. Looking for new friends...7 years coke free 2 years alcohol free ..There must be a better place to find friend s. ???Delete
I dig this page.ReplyDelete
I could rail on, but what would that proove?
One thing I've come to conclude about our species...
While giving high praise to thier value for "TRUTH", many will drop kick it in a heartbeat if it runs contrary to thier already-made-up, closed mind. What they REALLY crave is being viewed as RIGHT. Moreover, few can engage in honest confrontation without anger- rather, they'd FAR prefer to be surrounded by peer-pressure reinforced agreement. Try SAYING that at a meeting, or- I believe in the believable. If you eschew organized religion in deference to a self chosen, researched philosophy (in my case, Stoicism and Pantheism), you'll be throwing pearls before swine.
I was asked to leave a candle light meeting at "The Canyon Club" in Laguna Beach, CA. I stepped out into the cold rain and looked to the heavens with a smile. They acted as though my views were being expressed by someone drunk. I have NEVER capitulated to group-think. It has won me enemies. The fact is, some people are NEVER going to like or love you. Consider the source. Many people deserve each other. Hew to your own internal code,work to help where you can, and never hurt an innocent person.
Thank you for reading!
I arrived at the AA is a Cult conclusion too. The difference is, I had the temerity to state it in several different meetings, places, cities. Same angry reaction. Many of these people are- just one level deep, arrogant H8'rs. It takes mere intelligent articulation to prove: NOTHING UNIFIES MEDIOCRE MINDS QUICKER OR MORE EFECTIVELY THAN A COMMON ENEMY. Cowardice is common, bravery rare- thus valuable. When you have and manifest it- nutters go full-on apoplectic.
I say everything I have to say, first with my actions, then my spoken and written word. If that doesn't cut through, my musicianship (see link above) expresses me as best I can. Deaf ears are what they are, whether you, me or the fencepost exist or not. Truth rings true.
UNSUI = Zen, for "Truth Seeker". :) Marc
So true!! It is such a drop in human expectations and time consuming (let me count the cracks on the ceiling) to sit in these non-intelligent,self seeking approval for a life with no direct signs of ownership for own's behavior!!!Delete
AA doesn't force you to do anything you don't want to do.Delete
Wrong. Thousands are forced to attend AA meetings.Delete
Thousands are forced to attend aa meetings, not BY aa. AA doesn't force you to do anything you don't want to do. Your probation officer, the judge, your treatment provider... they may require you. That is not the fault of AA.Delete
Bullshit! Just like A.ADelete
, many judges po's etc. are AA and the court system has been rallied by AA, FUCK AA
each time i go to an AA meeting my desire to drink escalates and my hatred for the morons in the program escalates more.....ReplyDelete
the program, i am certain, has killed more weak minds than it has helped. period.
AA is full of idiots who prey on young people who are struggling. They use and abuse them. I've seen it happen at many AA meetings. There is no help there. They talk about drinking and it wants me to drink more. I think "I'm not as bad as that person." LOL Go figure. I think it's just a cult. They all got out and have one after the meetings.ReplyDelete
Keep coming back.........................Delete
This comment has been removed by the author.ReplyDelete
not trying to bash aa, but i feel like the program is making me bat shit crazy. I feel like in the back of my head if i dont "get it" ill never have a good life, period, since everyone in aa would agree with that. well shit then, i am out of luck, because from the moment i walked in there i knew there was no way in hell this thing was going to do anything for me.ReplyDelete
plus in aa no one will say simply what aa is all about. thats why I agree with you here, it is a god program, period. a "high power" is o.k., as long as that higher power is a "he" (as we understood him). Im really dying because being indecisive in general is no good for me, and I cant decide if im an alcoholic, the word has never felt right, at all. its not obvious given my history. what is obvious is something is messed up. im supposed to believe that how messed up i was before i ever took a drink is a sign of alcoholism? seriously? and base my whole life etc. around that assumption? i mean ive been trying to do that, but its a little difficult. you cant see alcoholism- a disease, like you can see cancer- a disease, with a microscope. it is a name, a concept whose definition is not clearly given in aa. it doesnt make any sense, and i must be incapable of being honest with myself, but honestly it doesnt make sense. its not a disease. it can cause problems with some people, it interacts with different peoples bodies differently. is that a disease? or is it just acting differently for different people. i feel too scared to even talk to anyone in aa they scare the hell out of me, and to say any of this to anyone in aa, would obviously result in accusations of denial and resentments, that i just want to get drunk etc. (i never even think about drinking... really, not hard at all to quit since day one) well... Alright this is a pointless rant anyways im sure its all wrong. I feel like god hates me everytime i go to aa, like growing up youth groups. probably the worst feeling ever. anyways reading this did help me out a lot, with venting for whatver its worth. helps counteract that feeling as i sit in a meeting and resist the feeling that my brain must be rotten.
AA works for some people, and to them I say, "If it works for YOU, that's great -- but it doesn't work for me and I'm out of here." However, if you think you're drinking too much, you probably are. Alcoholism is a disease in the sense that it's an influence that a lot of people can't control, and it destroys your body, takes over your life, and can kill you. It was an eye-opening thing for me when I discovered that musician Gerry Rafferty died of liver failure due to his alcoholism.Delete
For ME, the only thing that worked was re-discovering the things that made me HAPPY -- and even that is a day-by-day thing.
You have to do what works for you. AA is NOT the "magic bullet" that non-alcoholics seem to think that it is. For some of us, it's just another thing to make us feel worse.
Best of luck to you.
Evidence suggests that AA works better for people who are religious. For everybody else, there is no evidence whatsoever that AA is more effective than quitting without a 12-step program.Delete
There is no one "right" way to recover from alcohol addiction, as there is not only one way of having a drinking problem.
AA don't have the monopoly on truth as to who is or isn't an alcoholic, how they should feel about it and how they should fight their addiction. They're faith-based, not science-based. If you're not religious, I see no point signing up in a cult.
AA is effective for some (and it's great for them) but there is no evidence that it's more effective than other strategies.
If you cant find a meeting that you like, then dont go.Delete
AA is bullshit, and so is atheism.ReplyDelete
I completely agree with the author. Are you in Waterville, Maine by any chance. AA sucks big time, especially in the snooty town I am in. Everyone sits there all grim. And the boring droning monologues that go on in these monotone voices wow, so much more fun than when i was drinking..not.ReplyDelete
I had to chair a meeting and was so nervous, and not one person in that room gave me a break. They all sat there with stone faces staring at me as I bumbled along. ASSHOLES>
My sponsor actually called me a WHORE today (i havent had sex in 6 years) then said 'oh i was only kidding) she is a sick controlling bitch. Then i confronted her at the meeting and she DENIED it.
oh and the happy dappy meetings. i can so relate. feel like i am in middle school. sounds like i am in the middle of a henhouse, everyone chriping and laffing so merrily, and i am sitting there feeling like an outcast. its so untrue that people wil reach out to you. i have tried and tried to make this aa thing work. i have been in the community three years and they are such a tightly bound clique that i have not gotten one damn number. no one cares about helping anyone else. and you are right, i'm sure the aa propagandists will tell me its ALL MY FAULT that i have a negataive attitude. well guess what if the people in aa ever helped,me instead of ignoring me i wouldnt have a fucking bad attitude.
I hear you all. The feeling like am I in some delusional state because this AA "I finally got a sponsor and worked the steps and everything is gift and I'm so grateful to AA" What? I am really, really, yes an alcoholic. I have done a lot in recovery. 4 world class rehabs (and AA people- there was a little more to it than a $40k Big Book. Like I was 25 year old girl that was at deaths door from secretively drinking a gal a day of rodka. The 30 days where good to detox fully. Anyway, sober 10 years, relapsed 2 years ago. It was super bad. Detox, ER, rehab and about 1,000 AA meetings. I've tried the program. All steps, service.. IT MAKES NO SENSE.Delete
Oh and now I'm finally sober for good 6 months. Feel great. Don't want to drink. Abstinence for life- I have to, others may not and that sounds awesome too. Now that I've come to believe that I'm only going to get drunk if I drink, my sponsors sponsor is worried I'm going to die because I'm not willing to do ANOTHER 4th step. Steps don't do shit for me. That stuff I get with a therapist. The group support can be wonderful in the beginning, but all these nice people do want something in return- buy in, believe, give slogan filled "shares" and repeat tomorrow. I'm so sick of it.Delete
That's great that you have six months. I am coming up on 8 months and have not done the steps with my (former) sponsor. What makes me sick is I told her all of these personal things about me, and now that I know her, I find out she is a mean gossip. Funny thing is I never liked her. but, I ignored me initial feelings, thinking oh she has 17 years, its probably not true she's a beeyotch. Well trust our intuition. I found that oug.Delete
Steps ..yeah..be careful..i almost shared my fifth with one of the sickest ones in the bunch. Im going thru the steps the bob and charly ? tapes on xa speakers. you dont need a sponsor to do the steps. You do need a sharing partner for the fifth tho. You can use anyone for that you trust, does not have to be an aa person. in the early days there was no such thing as sponsors. I'll probably use my husband, he never listens anyways. well maybe not he can use stuff against me lol. yeah, take a drink and you will die. so dramatic. i mean i'm sure its happened and i dont want to try it. so sick of these aa maroons!
Congrats to you as well? Sober is good. I did the back to basics program last year. It was a good experience. The best part was that I did all the steps in a row and felt like I accomplished something... Until I slipped again drank for 4 days, detox... Then I had to start all over again. I've also tried all the anti drinking drugs-Antabuse naltrexone campral topamax. I went to a medical/nutritional rehab, had DNA testing, IV supplements, no sugar, etc.. But really I was stuck between wanting to drink and not wanting the inevitable awfulness. That lifted around 30 days this time. I know a shit ton about alcoholism, but still don't know why or how it shifted to sanity. I also know a lot about sobriety-10 years of neutral bliss. So I have this mtg wed w/ sponsors sponsor. The grand matriarch of "the family". She's definitely caring and has good intentions, but speaks endless slogans and God God God If she asks me what I think, I'm gonna tell her the truth and deal. Btw she's a total gossip too. That's really sucky about AA. They have all these other suggestions written on the wall- how about "Don't talk shit about people". I'll post back if anything interesting happens. Take care.Delete
Hope things go well with your sponsors sponsor. Just remember this. One thing I've learned is...if they gossip about peopel TO you.they will also gossip about you. I have learned this the hard way.Delete
I think I might ask for topamax. The urge to drink has been kind of strong lately. I think it's mostly due to my living situation. And I have major depression.
Dont feel bad about the relapses. At least you're sober now. I have been in and out of AA since 1988 but the important thing is not giving up. I probably have 15 years sober but not in all one clunki so it doesnt ''count''. But you know what..It counts to me because I could have been dead if I spent those years drinking instead.
I am so burnt out with this small town AA. Gossip and not one woman has ever reached out to me. In 3 years. Fuck them. At least the back to basics is the real AA and not some 'exclusive' clique!
I am taking a break from meetings until I move out of this town. Which hopefully wil be soon. About the Back to Basics meetings...I did that too...I think that is the absolute best way to do the steps. Like they did in the old days before AA got all diluted by all this rehab bullshit, chanting, and rituals. In fact I am going to do that next month. The only thing was I got a really bad ''sharing'' partner last time. She was constantly talking about how busy she was, and kept cancelling on me to do the fifth step. If she is so fucking busy, why be a sharing partner..dumb beeyotch. If that happens again next time I am not going to put up with it and just ask to be put with someone else. Hope things go well Wed. !
Sorry I did not mean to threadjack. I just got carried away with my venting about the AA BS!
No worries. Venting is good for the soul. I'm happy that others are able to find some use in my ramblings.Delete
Someone above said they told a gossip about their situation for their 5th step. I know the 5th step says to tell another person, but I would tell my dog instead because he is better than most of the people I know....and I would find that acceptable. Sometimes you have to bend the rules slightly and interpret things in a slightly different way. Over the years people have become very selfish, back stabbing and liars. My dog however, loves and cares about me and keeps my secrets :)Delete
5th Step... Big Book page 74...Delete
Those of us belonging to a religious
denomination which requires confession MUST, and of
course, will want to go to the properly appointed authority whose duty it is to receive it.
I am not an AA Guru. I am not an AA Protege. I am not anything but a Sober Alcoholic. It has been a Privilege to listen and read all of your insights. Honestly I am on the fence so I looked up on Google about hating AA. But after reading all of your comments, a QUESTION occurred: With whom would I choose to spend time with? These complaining, paranoid, anti-social immature Malcontents who want to bitch and moan and be negative and hateful about sponsors and people who are not perfect and doing their personal best???? OR to meet with the very Kind people who have given me Rides! for the last year for no pay (since i cannot drive now), and they do it without asking for Money or Bitching about their life or anything else. Hmm.. Vitriolic Animosity people on this Blog Versus Sober people who get me to Doctor appts, AA Meetings, Choir practice, Kids' Gymnastics and Boy Scouts, Kids' Doctor appts, Kids Violin reheasals, Pharmacy, Grocery store, EVERYTHING WITHOUT COMPLAINING ONE GOD DAMN BIT!!!!!!!!. . . They never complain. Ever, and they will continue to Drive my ass around because I have a disease that gets me Arrested. Tell me . . .which would you choose? I would prefer to be with people who are paying it forward, and since the last 1-1/2 year that I have lived in NH, I have about 50 phone numbers from AA of people who drive me at a moment's notice without one angry or irritable comment. Not one, and they love me and will do anything for me and my children because they understand and they care about me. Hell---If you live near me I am looking for Rides for myself Daily and my Three Children. Will you do that on a daily basis without pay and without bitching and moaning???? AA people have my Back Big Time. Tell me, you complaining Malcontended self-centered Whiners. Would you be here for me as much as they have? Give me your phone number and give me rides for the next year. They NEVER complain as much as you have done on this Blog.ReplyDelete
Hey "I am not an AA Guru"Delete
I'm not an AA guru either but I have been to an AA meeting or two. You said you would rather not spend your time with complainers. However, about 75% of the people in AA complain about their problems and their issues. Sort of like you have already started complaining about the fact that you have been arrested and cant drive yourself to a meeting.
So, if you go to AA meetings negative complainers are exactly who you are going to be spending time with. For the rest of the day you will get to spend time with your own complaining, paranoid, anti-social immature self. You just wont be complaining about AA's bullshit....Yet.
To this anonymous "not AA guru" poster: I think if you read and digest the original post and then the comments that follow, you will see that our line all the time has been, "If it works for YOU, then go for it." But it's not good or even healthy for everyone -- and the only one "hating" on this page is YOU. Seriously, were you drinking when you wrote that post? I kind of recognize the signs.Delete
People need hope, and AA just simply isn't right for a lot of us. And it creates more problems and resentment when people treat us like there's something wrong with US because AA is not all it's cracked up to be. We are made to feel as if AA's failures are OUR fault -- and you know what? That's just simply Not True.
But, if it's REALLY working for you, then go to it. Just stop writing Hate crap about the others who have posted here, because it will get you deleted and banned in nothing flat, and that's a promise. I do not tolerate trolls on this site.
To the woman who loves AA because they drive her ass around everyday...and they'll do anything for you or your kids and not complain...that's literally the only positive thing you mentioned about AA. They will do what you need them to do without complaint..LOL. Who do you help?Delete
That sure as hell won't happen in Sanford Florida people judge you people talk about you behind your back people throw chairs that have long-term sobriety people been punched with long-term sobriety quite frankly some of the people I know that have 15 years are squirrely other than the people that come in in day 2 I love aa cuz it got me off drugs I haven't drank in 2 years because I don't want to. My mom died of cancer last year I was her care taker and now My friend of 16 years has small cell lung cancer and im taking care or him. I go to 2 meetings a day for months now and im sick of the crazy shit I hear from long term AA members.. Need to find other support ..Delete
All right Anonymous, and yes, Freder. I see what you mean. Seriously. I did go overboard (D'ya think???) My apologies. At least here is an Open forum for what works for some and what works for others, and AA is not for everyone. I am seeking out what works best for me, which is why I Googled "Hate AA" in the first place, and clicked on this discussion, which was enlightening. Then I became perplexed and defensive (D'ya think??) I recognize that. I wanted to see what other people who are not in the program are saying about it. In the Beginning (1930's), it was just a bunch of Guys and Women trying to help each other with a serious problem of addiction. Sometimes the program and suggestions of today's AA do seem Cookie Cutter. I try to keep an open mind (unlike the tone my former edgy comments, for which I now apologize!!). Since I just moved to a new state, I have found friendly and helpful people there, whom I needed when I just got here from 3,000 miles from home. Forgive the rant. I found it a fascinating discussion, if you would allow me to say that. . Honestly, my apologies for venting. Be well, and thank you for writing here.ReplyDelete
Thank YOU! All viewpoints are welcome here. One of my very strongest supporters is deeply into AA, and it works for her, and for that I am truly happy. Others have to find their own solutions and it is NOT easy. For me, what it requires is to stop living my life the way other people want me to live it and to start living the life that I want. That's harder than it sounds, and it's an ongoing battle. Thanks for lending your voice to the conversation.Delete
I thought you're not supposed to engage in public controversy?Delete
AA has made me utterly confused, and lose hope.. These people believe even if you "do not drink," this notion of the disease will "manifest and you will go crazy." You are supposed to live your life, not centre ur life around addiction and dramatics! How do you get out of this thing when u are here long enough?? It is mind coercion at its finest, and has almost destroyed any worth I have left... What to do?ReplyDelete
I've almost gone through all the steps with a sponsor and I feel worse about myself then when I first joined 2 months ago. I can't even share any of these feeling in a meeting or even my sponsor because the finger will be pointed at me that I'm at fault and it's something I'm doing wrong, when I've actually been doing the program honestly and following every direction. Now I know why the failure rate is so high. IfI come back 10 years from now it'll be the same people sitting in a circle saying the same things over and over while new people just keep coming and going.Delete
Try SMART Recovery you can read a bit about it here http://www.smartrecovery.org/ A non god secular rational approach that usesa REBT/CBT approach to change.ReplyDelete
Or SOS or WFS or Lifeline, all can be googled.
Well I'm definitely an alky. Live sober now But I've never wanted to drink more than after an leaving an A.A. meeting though. And no I don't even have a problem with all the god stuff that's in the program - it's the people that drove me out. It seemed more like a social club with cliques and I could not even get any help as everyone so busy socialising that a new person like me who is half dead goes completely unnoticed. I've seen other newcomers just come and go week after week in need of help -not receiving any and never returning - while the core group long member are too busy hosting their A.A. "potlucks" and just socialising amongst themselves. The least helpful and uncaring people I've ever known - almost as if they are brainwashed. Well I guess it's our fault as we are supposed to "reach out for help". Anyways, if you are a suffering alcoholic in the GTA, a word of advice - do not go to Back to Basics in RH.ReplyDelete
I hate AA. I'm in IOP because I did have a serious drinking problem, and the court (I haven't had my court date yet) would have forced me to, I"m sure. They made me go to AA and get a sponsor. She wants me to call her everyday and do the 90 in 90. I'll play along for now because I have no choice. But I do not need AA to keep me sober. The consequences of my drinking have scared the hell out of me, and turning me into some sort of crazy person that I am not. I will not drink again. And I do not need AA to tell me constantly that I am a dry drunk or that I will fail if I don't follow their program. That is not a life. I prefer to live happy, knowing I conquered this on my own, and my life is turning into something wonderful already. I am quite happy. I actually wake up everyday with a smile on my face, embracing this beautiful life. And I do believe in God. I refuse to live in fear. I refuse to constantly think I am doing something wrong. My common sense tells me that trying to be a better person, helping others, and doing what I believe is morally good, is better than anything AA can offer me. I would have given AA a chance to have a support system of former drunks, but I cannot deal with constantly being told I am not progressing and will drink again unless I follow their rules religously.ReplyDelete
This post really hits the nail on the head. It is exactly how I feel. My "sponsor" would always tell me I'm failing at the program because I'm not going to meetings. Well guess what ? I'm not drinking or using drugs. I guess we are not so powerless as they Say! Hearing this made me feel so much better about my choice to leave AA. Thank you!Delete
Yup YOUR way works for YOU.Delete
Sober for 14 months. My one year I was snubbed by so many in my home group. I have been outspoken about a few old timers that continue to run the show their way and say spiteful things in meetings. Yes I believe AA is cult related. I have said over and over I don't want what these people have. I spent my first year doing so much service work, giving rides, H&I meetings, baking thousand's of cookies and more rides to only hear these assholes keep saying you have to do service work when in fact they don't do shit but run their mouths. I am sick of hearing I almost lost my condo in downtown due to my drinking, flubtart you didn't lose it so shut the flub up. No matter how the slice it AA is religious. I feel like it is a branch of the Salvation Army without the uniforms. I made the decision tonight to leave AA as it has caused me more stress than my PTSD mind can handle. AA is for some and it does work for some but it is making me want to drink even though I don't crave a drink. If someone would ever ask me if they should go to AA I would be the first to say give it a try but be open in mind.ReplyDelete
OMG yes it feels like a branch of the salvation army also aa is a cult it's founder was a member of the free masons and also one of the Rockefellers who was an illuminati nwo it's all a parayamid sceame started along time ago by the elitesDelete
Wow. Such a lot of hatred here.ReplyDelete
I have now been sober for 21 years. It took me two DUI convictions and 4 inpatient rehabs, too. I know that there are 13 Steppers in AA, as well as a lot of "bleeding deacons" who think the place will crumble without their micromanaging. There are also thieves, gossips, and general all-around azzhats. But that's okay... When I can't hear in a meeting, I MOVE to somewhere that I CAN! I remember arriving late and having to sit with what I call "Paper People", those who are court-ordered or attending a program--- Guess what? Most of them don't want to be there either and are too busy checking their emails, texting, playing games, or running in and out for a smoke. How can you expect to hear anything? I have had issues with the "God" concept, too, but I can say that SOMETHING took away my desire to drink and drug long enough for me to get busy with a sponsor and work on those pesky 12 Steps! After three years of playing around, I actually DID them. It worked for me. This is no game, friends! Unless you are CONVINCED that you can NOT have "just one" or that "this time it'll be different!", you will surely drink again. That's what REAL alcoholics, NOT heavy drinkers, DO! I'm sorry that some of you hate AA. I went through that stage, too--- the "Why do I have to come to these stupid meetings and listen to these stupid old people?" Then, miraculously it seemed, I made FRIENDS with some of them, and I even MARRIED one! Things haven't always been a bed of roses, but I can safely say that my life is better because of AA and its members. Sure, there are plenty of buttheads, but they are everywhere, sadly. Here is another very important thought for all of you haters---try to see the SIMILARITIES rather the DIFFERENCES between you and the next person. Move where you can best hear and see the chairman, etc. Those people you can't stand? They just might have something important to say.
A good try but not fooled anymoreDelete
AA is a religious cult: orange-papers.org - all thoroughly documented and evidence supported. AA IS a religious cult.Delete
AA is for loons. It promotes s sense of dependency without any personal responsibilities. It destroys relationships and promotes loneliness that can only be filled by another AA member. If not a cult...close as I'll ever wish to experience.ReplyDelete
Exactly am sitting outside of a room waiting for the person inside he needs a ride yeah I've been doing this for over a year yes it's destroying my feelings for this person it's a brainwashing cult or as I like to think of it as a bar with all the bs except no alcohol now it's doughnuts ciggs and coffee while the women entice the men into the hopeless thoughts can't stand this group of self loathing ego self centered selfish poor me people and there is only one God not a God of our understandingDelete
I have spent the last 13 yrs of my life listening to these unhappy self centered pricks,the penny has dropped Ive got bored,theyre driving me insane,everytime I go and share I feel sick,this is my soul saying get out get out,thank you God for showing me...ReplyDelete
Yes the one and only real true God has spoken to you their higher power bs God is bs that's why you felt like you had to get out because it's a sick cult yeah I like how they have their meditation meetings filled with candles and in sense burnings relaxing for an hour to caltic music give me a break how selfish is thatDelete
I spent 11 years in AA.....then I asked for my misery back. At a lot of meetings you hear, "do 30 meetings in 30 days, after that if you decide AA isn't for you your misery will be cheerfully refunded." After 11 years I was so miserable I just wanted to die, and it kept getting worse!! I finally had a drink and yes, the first few months weren't too good.....then I went back to drinking occasionally, I haven't had a drink in months, because I don't want one. knowing I can have one anytime I want makes a huge difference! I am so much happier now.ReplyDelete
the other issue I have with AA is they keep harping on how you can't depend on anyone except yourself. well, the problem with that is we are human beings, and need other people! even though we are all fallible, and will disappoint someone at some time we still need each other. My husband joined AA when he was 18 yrs old, after 30 years in AA he didn't/doesn't know how to have a relationship!! just trying to have a conversation with him is like pulling teeth. AA has done him a grave disservice.
My brother is sober 20 years and can't have a relationship because of AA. He tries very hard and had meet a perfect partner, but he can't connect and is living his life 20 years ago, he has never moved on and is reminded 3-4 times a week how is life way 20 years ago. All this you are not in control and you can inly depend on yourself has deprived him of the life he should of had. He suffers from chronic depression and can not maintain connects with people who really care about him. He has no friends except a few people he chats to in the rooms. Even his GP is in AA, he has no life is now in his mid 50 and he could have had such a wonderful, fulfilling adult life. He is hard working and creative and totally dragged down by the addition of AA meetings and its rigour and dogma from the last century. AA is killing my brotherReplyDelete
I have a cousin in AA who has turned into a complete asshole. His wife drinks, that's ok. His whole family drinks, that is not ok. I believe that alcoholism is a symptom of a much larger emotional issue which is dealt with by drinking, period. AA is a bunch of people who sit around and pray all the time to not pick up. They also want you to diminish your own personal worth by succumbing to some notion of powerlessness. No fucking thanks; I am the master of my own fate, thanks very much. Having said that, if when you do drink you take a dump on the dining room table and set the house on fire, you should recognize that you should not drink. But not drinking to make other people in AA feel righteous is not in my game plan.ReplyDelete
There are Smart recovery meetings a half hour away in Augusta, ME. Maybe it's worth looking into? smartrecovery.orgReplyDelete
glad i read this page.. i was in aa for many years.. i left after realizing i was feeling worse and worse with every mtg..ReplyDelete
hear you ...in and out of meetings for 25 years, mostly out....but have not had a drink for 25 years...would not want to do it over agains..seems that I started feeling worse because I could not buy into the crap of all the wonderful people who cared so much about me until it was me who needed a ride or a favor or an ear...funny how that happens...found a few better friends outside AA then inside...that is how it's been for me..Delete
Yesterday I became 5 years sober. For me it has been a great ride although difficult at times. From the beginning I assumed personal responsibility for my own spiritual development. I couldn't have done it without the support of some of the folks I met in aa. Some of which are still sober, most of which are not. For me it is a continuous program of action, so there is no such thing as finishing the 12 steps. I don't know why some get it and some do not but I do believe that it is my responsibility to be there for others as was done for me. Just like with liquor, there is a wide array of quality. I found too that this is the case for AA. In other words, some AA clubs are more solution oriented than others. I went to at least 4 different places before I felt at home. Now those places I used to shun and denounce, I intend to bring light to. God bless and goodnightReplyDelete
congrats and amazing story you have enlightened my little 3 3/4 years butt.Delete
My doctor would not give me Vivitrol because he wanted me to join AA. FUCK BOB AND YOUR FAKE BIBLE!ReplyDelete
Next, tell your doctor to do some reading about naltrexone pharmacological extinction studies.
AA good place to pick up Chicks, they don't care if you married at AA, anything goes. I sent by Courts to get paper signed twice. Be careful what you "share" at AA, I convinced Cops, Narcs, snitches ,scammers, burglars and others listen to what people say so they can "set them up" and yes these people are in the Meetings. Someone brought up something on my record I never said and would never say at a meeting and tried to convince me I did share that in a Meeting. How did they know that unless they checked me out.ReplyDelete
Sex and Love Addicts Meetings started up at same time as AA now all the creeps on probation and parole that are sex offenders are there getting paper signed and it's weird when they are "in the house" a lot of people stopped going to AA when they are there. Many people with long term AA sobriety around here commit suicide. AA, no thanks.
I suppose you could call most things you choose to do as being part of a cult (without the religious part of if) if you go to the pub your choosing to be in the pub culture same as anything swimming, football, chess book clubs or whatever you choose to do. I don't reckon you'd engage in anything if you didn't think it was right for you.ReplyDelete
I read the book 'living sober' which I found to be a great beginners guide to stopping drinking and it explained to me in simple terms that I'm gonna have a lot of time on my hands which i was spending drinking.
I've been using the AA meetings to fill in the hotspot drinking times like Friday nights and the weekends.
I certainly don't like many of the people I've met at AA especially the old timers preaching to me that following the programme and the steps so I choose not to spend any time with them. After all if was was in the pub I wouldn't choose to make friend with people I didn't like or have any time for.
I don't understand most of the terminology of the steps or have a sponsor - if I went down that route I know I would just loose interest and stop going.
Last Christmas due to family being overseas I found I had no family to go to or mates houses as I knew they would be drinking heavily being Christmas day and hope everyone had a great day.
AA laid on the full day self funded with Christmas dinner raffle disco and stuff so you just chose the bits you wanted to go to with no pressure - surely that's gotta be a good thing.
In conclusion I know I'm not doing the steps and sponsor etc stuff properly but on the plus side i've not been drinking for 3 months, have met some new mates (not the preachy ones!) and have a bit of a social life again Cheers Allan UK
AA is an archaic moral movement that is gradually dying out as the USA becomes more secular and evidence-based approaches take hold in the rehabs. It will still be around for decades to come but much smaller in scale relative to the population.ReplyDelete
AA doesn't make sense to me. How is sitting in a meeting, hearing people talk about what's going on in THEIR lives supposed to help ME. We all live different lives! Albeit we have problems with alcohol, what else? I know that this program can't be for everyone.ReplyDelete
This has been an interesting read. So much anger, especially in the comments. AA is not for everyone. If you have found a way to stay sober that works for you, then by all means, share it. It seems that your time would be better focused on what worksReplyDelete
I found this mantra to rid me to AA's brainwashing dogma which does not work and holds back my recovery:Delete
Bad Religion. Bad People. AA!
At many meeting I had suggested a happy topic like "Being happy for what we got back" and of course that was derailed after a somewhat pleasant meeting - into an Alca Nazi changing it to - I'm happy for things I didn't get anymore. Lawyers bills, hangovers, blackouts - on & on. We are not a glum lot. Look in the mirror. They're all living in a miserable past with no happy future ahead. Oh sorry I must be pissing on today.ReplyDelete
Most alcoholics just lead bad lifestyles that leads to drinking getting out of control. You can spend an hour a day with a bunch of people and obsess over drinking or devote that hour to working out, fixing your diet, joining a group, or any number of other productive things that actually empower you. The idea that you're powerless over alcohol is just ridiculous. In reality, you're powerless over life. Most addicts are pretty OCD. If you redirect that substance abuse energy elsewhere, you'll find yourself succeeding in life and the desire to drink to excess will go away. In started to work the steps, but I'm the middle of doing so, went, "wait a second. Rather than focusing on all the stupid stuff, why don't I focus on improving myself?" For me anyway, AA just turned me into an overthinking basket case. But like others have said, if it works for you, that's just fine. But after regaining my health and devoting myself to interests other than triggers and balancing my life, I feel great and gasp, can even have a few glasses of wine every now and then without spiraling out of control.ReplyDelete
I was in AA for five years. It is elitist and cliquish and filled with crazy people. Not really different from my drinking buddies actually, but without booze to make things even worse. But AA is not for everyone and I too grew weary of being blamed for the fact that my program was 'bad'. When I do good or good things happen, it's "God working for you", but if the exact opposite happens, it's either my fault somehow or "where God wants you to be right now". And the "mean girl" cliques have left a bad taste in my mouth...the people with long-term sobriety picking on each other to share and you are basically listening to the same shit over and over from the same people over and over. It's been over a year since I last attended a meeting and I have no real regrets.ReplyDelete
Take a look at this. http://www.amazon.com/The-Truth-About-Addiction-Recovery/dp/0671755307ReplyDelete
I didn't fit in 12 steps more than 30 years ago. We are basically the sum of our habits , mental , social , emotional , and physical. Destructive drinking or drugging, eating disordering can be one of these habits and perhaps the easier to do according to the sum of rest of the other kinds of habits. The twelve steps covers some of that ,but goes too religious and is too fear based(irrational).
I have drank moderately ,or less ,for more than those 30 years and the terrible eating disorder I was in in my teens is nothing. You don't need to go become some kind of parrot in a twelve a step program.
AA is so outdated, sexist, and based on the Oxford group - a right winged neo Nazi group from England. Dr Bob and Bill W. were crooks - and Bill W. sexually exploited innocent women in the program. The Big Book is so outdated. Omg - the last meeting I attended I about jumped out of my skin when they read "To the Wives". (which implies that its partly the Womans fault) LOLOLOL. I was in the cult for almost 12 years. Relapsed and tried to go back. OHHHHH the shame. Finger pointing. Gossip. And I suddenly realized that the ones I knew from the first year were unemployed or underemployed, robots, and in constant fear. Quoting slogans like zombies. It's taken me 2 years to deprogram and I am still reeling from the memories of being hit on by scumbags, rambling drunkalogs and the badly written outdated literature. It got me sober - but after a year or two I wish I had moved on. I am finding sobriety in some really great private therapy and a spiritual group that I love. Good luck to all of you with your sobriety. AA is NOT THE ONLY WAY. And yes very low recovery rate if you look at the stats. Its just the most commercialized and money making program out there. Check out Smart Recovery. Also the Orange Papers. Don't feel guilty. AA is like an old church that is living in the dark ages. GET OUT if it makes you feel worse.ReplyDelete
The message that seems to be mostly conveyed (sifting through all the bashing parts) is "It didn't work for me". What about "it" specifically "did not work" (meaning did not keep you clean and sober)? My own beginning story was that "it" didn't work for me, cause I chose not to do what it says to do... then when I was using again, simply blamed "it". The slogan "works if you work it, doesn't work itself" comes to mind. All of the other "ways" that are mentioned here are the same way, including "Smart Recovery" - they work if you work them. AA never says they are "the only way". If you all have found other true solutions to your substance abuse problems, then great! That is really the only thing that matters isn't it? I just find it interesting that there seems to be such a need to degrade simply another program and many find works just fine, including me.ReplyDelete
Oh please get over yourself. No ones blaming the program. We're talking about our experiences dealing with problematic people in the program like you.Delete
Can any of you steppers even talk without regurgitating the cult speak? And to say that AA doesn't say it's the only way is just flat out bullshit. Their precious book more than just hints at the idea and the cult members will tell you the only alternative to their little cult is jails, institutions and death.Delete
Furthermore, research has shown it is not only ineffective, it makes many people worse. More and longer binges and a worsening in general of their habits. Likely because they are told by the big book of garbage that they can't control themselves. And because they are told by cult members that they must not have had enough. The bottom hasn't gotten low enough. Bla. Bla. Bla.
You people are all even more insane sober.
I think alcoholism is a psychological disease (or maybe I mean condition?), something like ptsd. You know, like somewhere along the line your mind just gets stick in this loop. Drinking used to be fun and consequence free. Now it's not but I can't get over the urge to do it anyway. I have been going to aa meetings for about a year. I don't think they're a cult, just kinda off a bit. I imagine mason's meetings with the secret knocks and handshakes. It's all just a little too much for grown people. I mean that whole God is a doorknob thing cracks me up. Plus I think there is a way too much reverence placed on the big book.ReplyDelete
I keep going though because smart meetings are a little to mystic and new agey for me. I don't know how to meditate or live in the moment. I don't wanna start drinking lattes and doing yoga. I can't change my self talk to the therapy way. Apparently I can't quit drinking either, lol. I still do it every damn day, (except yesterday, woo hoo).
Pretty much sums AA up in my view although not an alcoholic personally my partner was. He had sadly turned into an outwardly unloving bore who would rather hang about hearing the same anecdotes, stories and quips than spend time with me and the time he does I get chapter and bloody verse or quoted at or the odd sermon.ReplyDelete
His idea of fun these days is wandering around supermarkets (Just shoot me please we've been down this aisle four F**king times already). To cut a long story short; I moved out but not broke up. I love him and he knows it but he has become very manipulative to the point to try and save our relationship I had to get out as being quoted at was destroying what remained.
I've been to open meetings and its Deja vu. I went to Al Anon too but I found this was also soul destroying as they are just as bad and like the walking wounded after the destruction an alcoholic tsunami they are left hugging their own knees rocking back and forth with ‘Why me’. Or another moan about what they did/didn’t do to me this is like watching a fly slowly twitch it's last after failing to find the open window mere inches away).
I hope he leaves AA. True, he's got some genuinely nice friends there (but are they)? He gets badgering text messages and calls. I have a feeling he is being trawled by 13th steppers because despite being a private person he's told them, their cat, dog, aunt, sister and even his bosses (unfortunately he didn't hang up his phone I heard him discussing me like a big joke so I know exactly what he has said may as well served my soul up on a platter with other cuts of cold meats and devilled
eggs) and I hate to say it but after six and a half years (six of those engaged) I feel like telling him to sod off.
I love him but he seems to have gained the arrogance that he can get a girl (most likely one of the boring vultures who hunt down fresh or wounded meat) So I am made to feel like an expendable commodity. I wish he could see what it has done to him yes it helped him in a way to stop drinking but really he's turned into a sweetie munching aisle curb crawler that thinks it's funny when he pretends to lust after pretty girls in short skirts.
He also quotes the AA handbook and things from his sponsor like those mole people who go to church and quote chapter and verse if you don't think in the same way...No wait I forgot I'm a them and cannot belong to the special club of us. So to you who have escaped I raise a glass be it milk, a cup of joe or a juice or something brewed like tea and say thank goodness you survived and found your way out of those dull damp back rooms and didn't go back.
This blog speaks to my experience with AA over the past eight months. Found out the hard way that anonymous it was not. I have returned to private therapy and am working through the Smart Recovery tools.ReplyDelete
oh fuck AA. Seriously it is brainwashing garbage. You can choose to be sober without it. Just get some protein in your diet and get a therapist to work out why you drink.ReplyDelete
I did 12 steps on and off for years. They do not work. Period.
Smart Recovery offers tools.
Lifering revolves around normal people.
but AA is a cult.
If you want to go or have to go --- GO--- but watch out for the dudes if you are a lady and don't get addicted to meetings or the freaking donuts and coffeee.
I used to go to a meeting for the cookies. My boyfriend called it the cookie meeting.
I miss AA sometimes. The stories and the fake connection. but now it is time for me to live my real life. with real people. some drink and some don't!
What really needs to be discussed is AA's war on Naltrexone/Vivitrol. Despite their effectiveness, AA really lobbies against doctors proscribing them. It is easier to get Oxycodone. AA has no interest in curing or making anyone better. 12 step programs are nothing more than a government sanctioned religious revival.ReplyDelete
I'm a younger guy(33)I've been going to AA for a month and a week now. It's a large meeting about 40 people. I've noticed 80% of the group is an older crowd 50s and up also noticed the cliques, gossip and club house mentality.was welcomed fairly warmly at first. But slowly began to notice some annoyance that I wasn't sharing. It's just not my personality I was still seeing where I fit in in this group but would listen attentively as people spoke. Then tonight a guy behind me was talking to his buddy about fighting someone because he was not sharing and mumbling stuff to him about somebody not sharing and how he was going to kick his ass. A man then stood up and left the meeting and didn't come back I'm not sure if he was talking about me or him. He was basically threating physical violence for not conforming to their indoctrination. Anyway I'm going back tomorrow sitting right next to the guy to see if he has anything to say to my face then I'm done with AA. It's to dated and there are lots of other options these days I would say AA has intreached it's self in our society but I don't see it as an option for younger generations.ReplyDelete
I'm thirty and I attended AA in Los Angeles for three or four years. I found it to be very cold and isolating. It was very Hollywood. The larger meetings were always very clickish. In one of my earlier meetings I met an Indian woman. Being a middle eastern guy it was nice to connect with a woman outside of the usual white crowd of AA. She was smart and very sucessful. We seemed to connect. White guys from other meetings took an interest in her, because she was tall, dark skinned, and spoke with an english accent. She had a big nose and ugly feet, but that didn't bother me. All the racist, superficial white women in AA who only took interest in the pretty white boys and then all these white boys wanted to chase after the one indian girl in the room. It ruined my relationship with her and any chance we had of dating. Her sponsor convinced her us socializing was a bad idea and then other woman tried introducing her to their male friends.ReplyDelete
It still pains me to think about what could have been.
Then I had a sponsor that was a music engineer thst used me for rides and favors. It turned out he was more interested in making contacts from the program to help his music career than helping me with my program.
I tried different meetings with different people and it only continued to go down hill from there. More failed relationships. More disapointments. I was abused, used, and stabbed in the back.
Any of it hardly seemed worth it. I found myself surrounded by cynical self concious fake people who spent alot of time gossiping about me and each other by their backs to feel better about themselves. And everyone always pretended to be so happy and it always came across as eerie and forced.
I spent an hour writing an email witj a heart felt apology that was very sincere and personal to my old indian lady friend only to be ignored.
I'm sure she doesn't acknowledge my existence or even care.
I think it best to move on and forget about her and AA all together.
AA......my heart's devotion. Let it be thrown into the ocean.Delete
Sober and AA free and still loving it!.
When I first walked into an AA meeting I thought - fantastic! - a whole room full of people who don't hate me because I'm a drunk (in the rest of my life I am hated and punished for being a drunk), - so far, so good. I sit down and a guy casually drops a card in my lap that says "let go and let god" - what the hell am I supposed to do with that! Give it back to him? It was kind of good to be amongst people who didn't hate me for a while and I really needed that, but I couldn't really buy into all the 'church of AA' stuff. The pressure to 'do the steps' was too much. Especially step 9 - apologize to everyone for everything you've ever done? Everyone has already taken way more revenge out on me for anything I've ever done to them and they're still doing it. No-one gets my apologies except for my children. So, no more AA for me, except for maybe a quick chat and a cup of tea.ReplyDelete
I defiantely get where your coming from. I think the part about making amends to people, especially your enemies is total b**ls*t. You can forgive someone without even making contact with the person. I had people from AA who have been in it for years who did me wrong. We come to AA for relief and then other people from the program can and will attach themselves to us to fabricate more drama. You think I'm going to make amends to those people? Heck no. They best stay the hell away from me so I can focus on dealing with my own sh*t.Delete
I done been sent to AA by the courts and went to meetings not feeling like drinking and after hearing "War Stories " about drinking I left feeling like I want to drink bad! It had a reverse effect on me. Good place to "Pick up Chicks" that's about it 1% long term recovery rate at the clubs I went to. Some people at the AA CLUB WITH LONG-TERM SOBRIETY sleep on peoples couches, no job, no car , divorced over and over , more problems in sobriety than ever had when drinking, sober or drunk a Loser is still a Loser! No 12 Steps for that! They have nothing I want. AA preamble "If you want what we have , you are ready to take certain steps".ReplyDelete
AA has become somewhat of a hipster movement. A scene if you will. At least here in LA. I sit in on meetings from time to time as an observer, or to socialize. Its more of a social club than anything. The men are desperate. The women are insecure and petty. Its no so bad. As long as you know what your getting yourself into. You have to know how the game is played. Most of the people in the rooms are lying anyways.ReplyDelete
I did AA for many years here in Los Angeles. You meet a lot of interesting characters. The truth is most of the people you meet in these 12 step groups are trashy people who never truly recover, most of them red necks. They gossip and talk sh*t about you behind you're back, and form clicks. Their some of the worst people. They treat sobriety like a front. Its mostly for show and tell. They want to get as many people to join in the cult as possible.ReplyDelete
My advice, don't let AA people rub off on you. Never use the "F" word, "FRIEND" in AA. In AA you have no friends, just acquaintances and pretenders. They'll talk about you behind you're back, and can on you at anytime. If you your not good looking enough, or don't have something they want that is.ReplyDelete
I understand how addicts can need AA as a solution, but if your not truly an addict than AA can be socially isolating. I like to go out and interact with people. When you surround yourself with nothing, but program people it tends to become a cult.ReplyDelete
I just got back from a lame meeting. Most of the people spouting off at the mouth we're trying to lecture and talk at you which to me is a real turn off. I just like to hear peoples stories and interpret the hidden message or meaning that way.ReplyDelete
Cause I went to a meeting last night where a bunch of young speakers spoke a bunch of non sense that didn't articulate to much, but then came the main speaker who spoke phenomenally that I could really resonate with.
At the meeting I went to today I saw a couple douchebags I can't stand who stabbed me in the back at one point. One of them had the audacity to piggyback off the burning desire share.
Talking about himself. Me. Me. I. I. I. LOL. Its like get over yourself.
After going to meetings for years you really have to filter out those types of people and filter out the bulsh*t.
There really is a lot of non sense in AA. You just have to weed through it.
I'm trying to give AA another go, but the meetings are so depressing. Today an older lady dressed like a slut in a tight little dress came to take a cake. She decided to sit and talk to the awkward gay guy with his big hairy legs crossed then sit next to me a straight normal looking guy. She refused to even say hello or acknowledge me.ReplyDelete
So when the meeting was over I just got up and left. The meetings have become really watered down. The quality of speakers has declined and so has the people sitting in on meetings. AA is a dying breed.
I'm a vet and I did the whole AA thing. The thing is these assholes from AA where never around during my struggles. When someone close to me died or I was feeling suicidal these AA fucks never picked up the phone, answered a text, or came around. Yet when one of these jerk offs up and ODs. You'll hear them bragg about how they knew the person and how it's got their panties in a bunch.ReplyDelete
Fucking posers. They don't give two shits about me or each other. Its a you scratch my back I'll scratch yours type of deal.
AA is total bulshit. I've lived it for 6 something odd years. And I'm living proof. Let these addict fuckers run themselves off a cliff.
I have almost three years clean and sober and found my sobriety in AA at 23 years old. I became a book thumper, ate that shit up, agreed with every fuckin line in the big book. At meetings I was most amazed by the people who seemed to be able to recite the big book and find eloquent ways to connect it all back to experiences and feelings. Looking back I am sickened by how committed I was to AA and how blind I was to other points of view, all the while thinking I was so open minded and smart and shit. Fuck me for that. I've been on both sides of the fence now and it's crazy to look back on myself like that, especially when I encounter past aa friends who look at me now like my past self would have looked at my present self... like I know what is best for someone else, feel sorry for them, and hope they come around to the "truth" and open their minds too one day. What bull shit. Fuck anyone who can be so judgemental and diagnose some other fucking person. AA is not for everyone, all the time. Around 2 years my life got really busy with school and work and I work harder than most people I know because I'm still determined to put the pieces of my life together while I am still young. I'm fuckin lucky that i feel like I still have that chance. For anyone to make me feel guilty, or a program to have instilled in me this belief that somehow I am fucking up or on my way to a relapse because I prioritize working hard instead of driving around picking up newcomers devoting my time to other alcoholics who don't give a fuck about me either, when I don't even have enough time to take care of myself? Fuck that. Fuck aa for making me live in fear of not being on top of my program so many times. The stress of that was greater than any stress I have yet to experience in sobriety. Once I finally realized that the guilt and fear of not being involved in aa was what would start to cause my anxiety every few months, as my involvement always seems to ebb and flow, and decided to stop beating myself up for not conforming to something previously had so fiercely subscribed to, I feel so much better. I can see clear now my journey through sobriety. I am no sober because of aa. It helped in the beginning but I don't need it right now. Maybe that will change one day but for now I am good and I am not too insane like they want to me to believe to eat able to determine when I am on my way out or not. I know what I'm doing and I still check in with myself, my family, etc when stress comes up in my life. No one can tell anyone else what is right for them.ReplyDelete
The last AA meeting I went to was in September of 2014...I've been sober since December 2008. I got so sick of the cliques, gossiping, self righteous people constantly shooting off slogans. My sponsor told me to talk to people, put myself out there because I'm so introverted - which he thought was BS because he told me introverts are basically hermits and hermits don't do well in AA...once I complained to my first sponsor about a negative incident that had happened to me and he gave me some harsh feed back which I didn't appreciate and I told him so. "Well, I don't give a F&&K about how you FEEL; my job is the help you stay sober and to look at the role you play in the incidents that happen in your sober life.". WHAT??? I could barely get his attention sometimes because he was too busy checking out young things in the coffee house where we would meet to go through the steps. Then he decided that his issue wasn't alcohol, but cocaine. So he went back to drinking...ok. My next sponsor was a little better, I thought, but he was cliquish and an attention whore - I realized this when we would do fellowship with other people from our LGBT group. They exhausted me. And now? He's transitioning - something totally out of the blue. And I'm atheist, so, the God thing doesn't work for me. I was on drugs that kept me from drinking. When I stopped taking them, the doctors told me I could go to AA. Well, I did, and I'm not sorry I did, but I don't really ever want to sit in a meeting with those nuts ever again. I'm happy to be a nut all by myself, thanks.ReplyDelete
I stopped going to AA after twelve years. My experience in AA was mostly positive, although the further I get away from it the more I realized that all was not well. I am much more peaceful and content now without consistent commitments looming over my head. The program became less and less healthy for me. Frankly, I'm not sure it was ever super healthy. It did separate me from the compulsive need to check out, but it also stole hours and hours of my life. I am no longer interested in sitting in church basements or discussing with various people this week's flavor of neurosis. I would rather do any number of other things. I am happy to be free of the rooms. I overstayed.ReplyDelete
Good to see I'm not the only one whose shared these experiences and had to take a step back from AA. I found theres alot of wolves in sheeps clothing in the rooms. You really have to be mindful and be careful. These people are sick. They'll creep up on you and try to manipulate you and take advantage of you given the chance.ReplyDelete
Heres AA in a nutshell.
AA is a substance recovery group of rednecks founded by a redneck. They'll say and do anything to get you to join. They all f**k each other, lie, cheat, and steal. And show up to meetings putting on their best like its Sunday church.
They see newcomers as fresh meat. Their so kind and inviting at first. Until they get you in the door and the pleasantries wear off.
Then if their jealous of you or you have something they want the gossiping and backstabbing, talking about you behind your back begins.
All these trashy f**k ups act like hypocrites. They try to make you think they can pass judgement on you and that you need their validation.
Listen I came to AA as a loner, and I left as a loner.
And I made more friends, real genuine friends after I left that sh*t behind.
Don't let them get into your head. Seek professional help.
Theres a white supremacy around the rooms that mimics everyday soceity no one talks about. I'm coming from Los Angeles.ReplyDelete
For example I was at a meeting in a church and they we're voting for a new secretary. Two black guys and one white dude we're nominated. The tall lanky white boy with tats on his arms was voted in.
One of the blacks and his black sponsor just looked at each other confused after the meeting, and played it off like it was fine.
It wasn't really. I'd been a member for years. A servant of selfless service. I still see a lot of bigotry and white supremacy.
The hill billies wipe each others asses and like to act like their superior.
I was terrorized by a couple of rednecks from a meeting after I moved out of a bad roommate situation about 3 years ago.
They've been dragging my name through the mud and started false rumors about me and all the whiteys from the meetings have jumped on the band wagon and cover for the them.
If my skin wasn't so tan maybe I'd have some sympathizers or signs of support, but no the white community tries to dominate.
I'm white and from a suburb so it was almost all whites there anyways, so I can't relate to that part but what I can tell you is these people are toxic. If you've been sober for years you don't need jackasses like that in your life. They are bottom feeders. Get the hell out of that cult and move on with your life. There is tons of support online from actual thinking people outside of the 12 step garbage. Why be surrounded by a bunch of racist cultish assholes? Plenty of us stay sober without that shit and you don't deserve to be treated that way.Delete
You are right about them being “bottom feeders”. It really hits the nail on the head. I can rattle off a list of names of all the people I know of that hang around the rooms who treat 12 step groups such as AA like a social club or networking opportunity here in Los Angeles. A personal trainer looking to gain more clients and sell their promotional garbage. A YouTube personality, comedian, or actor looking to gain more followers. Musicians trying to get people to show up at their shows. People trying to become famous looking to be friend celebrities. I know of a personal trainer/ dancer who used AA to befriend Jodie Sweetin from Full House. Shes always posting selfies with her on Instagram every chance she gets. I know of a couple with kids who are always trying to pool celebrities. Theres a bunch of guys I know who use AA as a hook up service to meet troubled women. Then there are guys always looking to use AA to find work or bum rides or money from people or find a place to crash. They basically use AA to leech off people moving from one person to the next. A lot of users in AA, literally.
Theres something really unattractive about sitting in a room full of sick people bent on being the center of attention.ReplyDelete
If your like me and you have a good heart and you like helping people I pray you don't get taken in by these 12 steppers.
My light was so bright, and my road paved with such good intentions when I started out,but I was met with so much jealousy and indifference that these
AA folks tried to discourage me or put me out anyway they could.
It wasn't until I stepped away from it all that I realized that these fools had no power over me.
And my life is better for it now.
If you really want to succeed in life, no need to join a cult of downers, take these simple steps:ReplyDelete
1) find a good therapist, and stick with them
2) learn meditation, and practice it religiously, and by that I mean daily
3) get into yoga, you'll always feel great afterwards
4) start going to the gym, and getting a good work out in
5) change your diet, eat healthy, mostly everything I eat fits in an electric steamer I bought on Amazon, you are what You eat, eat shit and expect to feel like shit
6) take healthy supplements, in talking like fish oil, multi vitamins, tumeric tablets, and brain pills, i even take supplements for my hair, i look and feel amazing, and I get nothing but compliments
Look I'm living proof that this shit works. I go back and see people still in AA years later and they havn't changed, except they still look miserable and look like they've aged 10 years.
My advice stay away from those sick people and make changes to your life style and make better choices, you look and feel great. I Do!
Oh yeah. Almost forgot these steps. Their very important.ReplyDelete
7) Cut toxic people out of your life, especially people from AA. Their miserable, self loathing people. Their emotionally draining to be around and their drag you down with them.
8) Learn to be comfortable in your own skin. Try doing things on your own for awhile. Understand that most people are dumbasses or assholes and they will disappoint and hurt you.
Never rely on someone else to make you happy. No one can make you happy except you. Co dependency is poison. You need to be ok on your own and happy with yourself for awhile before you hook up with someone.
I see people rebounding from one person to the next and its nuts.
Follow these life lessons and you'll be good.
AA meetings are good for one and only thing - if you're a freelance writer you can collect some interesting stories occasionally. People loves to read about other peoples misery because that makes them feel better about themselfs.ReplyDelete
I've been trying this AA thing and it just doesn't sit well with me. I am in therapy for PTSD from growing up in an alcoholic home with violence etc, then other stuff happened as life carried on. I also have bipolar and depression. The whole character defect and diminishing yourself is problematic. I can't take the sponsor thing, and that AA says the problem is spiritual. It's religious. I grew up in the church and I want nothing to do with this God business. I am in Johanneburg, South Africa and I've tried 7 different AA groups. I hate all the hugging. All that bloody hugging!! I asked the internet why AA isn't working for me and I'm glad I found this! It's a very obsessive cultish thing. Even all the way here in Africa! I'm about to start SMART - and in 10 minutes I am going to tell my therapist that AA isn't working - she is pro AA. I hope I won't end up having to change therapists. I'll make it through.ReplyDelete
Note that the "you" in this note is the "general" you. Anyway "You" might be part of your own problem ? I certainly was in my case but of course if you feel that you have a unique set of issues that can't be addressed using common approaches then you owe it to yourself to find something that does work. Here is a tip for anyone reading who doesn't like AA - simply do not go or if you have gone then don't go back. Also, don't blame AA because the court system dumps thousands of people into the AA pipeline. No one benefits from having angry court-ordered attendees in a meeting. Consider the following: "Person X thinks AA works. Person Y doesn't think that AA works. They are both right. This isn't a koan nor is it even an "AA slogan". People get help where ever they can and I wouldn't waste 5 minutes in something that doesn't work as along as I gave it an honest attempt. Seems to me that most people who despise AA don't really want to stop drinking anyway in which case nothing that anyone says is going to help. The same is true if you drop $90 grand to go to that place in Malibu where you ride horses, get massages, and make pottery to get "cured". My roomate in rehab went there and all that pottery making didn't keep him sober yet I don't see blogs devoted to taking down that place. I went to AA because it was/free and when I was at my worst I had no financial resources. If you do have money then investigate alternatives but NONE of them will work if you don't really want to deal with the substance abuse issue. Beause AA is free it accumulates a lot of people and reflects the larger distribution of society wherein some people are serious about cleaning up and others are just pretending to be getting clean to keep a job or a relationship. In the end if a person wants to whine and moan that AA (or SMART or PAssage or Scientology) doesn't work then maybe they should look into the mirror. If you don't really want to clean up then nothing is going to help so maybe stop blaming others ?ReplyDelete
I reject the premise of your defensive rant. I wanted to get sober, I HAD to get sober! My 12 year old daughter (at the time) deserved a better mother than I had. I promised her that the day I brought her home from the hospital- and in 2014 I decided to register for a 12 week outpatient program. That was my last drunk.ReplyDelete
The program required a.meeting a day. I knew AA would be uncomfortable, but I tried to embrace it... Fake it 'til you make it and all. After a year of 3-5 meetings a week I had had enough. I don't mind the God thing. I believe people should do and or believe in whatever works for them. And being around the true believers doesn't bother me. Frankly, I almost envy those with an unwavering faith. There must be a sense of peace in it.
Having grown up in a devote Irish Catholic family I don't see AA as "church," but no one can deny the dogma. Never once was I able to shake the feeling of cultish indoctrinate. What's worse, was the cliquey nature of the people at the meetings.
The people set the tone for the meetings. Living in a very rural area, all of the meetings within a 30 minute drive were attended by all the same people. Some attended 7-10 meetings a week or more. This is their whole life and they were very protective of their positions of power in their little pond. It was far worse than high school for me.
I volunteered, I brought snacks, made coffee, gave rides, got a sponsor (who dropped out of my life because of mommy drama she had at the school with a friend of mine. Just stopped calling or returning calls. Never heard from her again. She doesn't even say hi if we run into each other. Yup, feeling the support and the superior mental health there), worked the steps, the whole 9 yards. Not once did any of the people I gave my number to reach out to see if I was ok after I stopped coming. Not a single one of these now sober and "sane" people ever tried to engage me or welcome me to the fellowship. So yes... I HATE HATE HATE AA and all the sanctimonious cultists who stand on their sobriety soapbox.
You clearly appreciate AA and good on you, but everyone is different. Why is it acceptable for you to so vehemently express your opinion but the sharing of a divergent perspective angers you so? Perhaps you should heed your own advice... If you don't like it, move on. There was no reason for you to read the post or the comments. What's more, your haughty reply added nothing to the discussion - thought it did give ne the opportunity to do some ranting of my own. In fact, shame on you for trying to shame the people who are sharing and finding support from others who can empathise. No matter what the situation, people often find comfort when they realize they are not alone.
Lol. I drive by the AA meeting at the Unitarian church on Moorpark in Studio City here in Los Angeles all the time. I barely think about it anymore but sometimes I see one of these miserable bastards out in public or they pop up on my Instagram feed and it reminds me of how sad and pathetic most of them all are caught up living a lie all these years. Always new faces coming and going. Thats how often they use people and each other. Its mostly white supremacist red necks. They get off on that Bill Wilson bulshit. I see most of the women running around town without a man, because most of them are batshit crazy or to co dependant. And the men mine as well let their dicks hang out swinging. Their a real perverted bunch. God I do not miss being taken in by these fools. Such a relief. Stay away if you can help it.ReplyDelete
Heres an AA poster child at its finest. Sarah Christian. A white girl from a well off family in Georgia who talks and acts like shes black from the hood. She has to atleast be pushing 40 and she still acts like a teenage brat. A trust fund baby thats been in and out of rehab 20 times atleast for shooting heroin. She milks the dead junkies she barely even knew she used to get strung out with for sympathy and likes attention. And likes to quote black people. Recently she posed in a photo wearing a ceremonialReplyDelete
Native American headdress with the words "I'm tapping into my inner indian", followed by a crown icon. Even know some people found it offensive and expressed their disgust. She defiantly kept it up anyway. This is the type of sheltered trash that represents recovery groups under the hood. She demonstrated white privilege and all her white AA friends came rushing to defend her. AA is a cult movement centered around false recovery and dominated by filthy red necks.
I wasn't able to afford my 1 bedroom apartment centrally located in LA or the lease on my brand new luxury car from attending cultist AA meetings. Mean while the same leeches who I met at these sad get togethers years ago are still subletting rooms from people or milking strangers for favors. Maybe its just me, but I love having a good head on my shoulders and having money in the bank. Seems to me these addict clans that these lose addicts tend to run with are set a means to extort and leech off other people who actually work hard and contribute to the community.ReplyDelete
If you're not hearing recovery in the meetings you attend, Bring it. What ever happened to take what you need and leave the rest?ReplyDelete
No thank you. My finances are good. I just bought a brand new two story house outside of California. I've been in LA 8 years. Their letting homeless people live in boxes in front of the local Whole Foods a couple of blocks from my apartment now. This place is going down hill fast. Sure AA people are friendly at face value, but its a toxic community. They all talk shit behind each others back and the people drift apart. I'd been stabbed in the back and used so many times by these so called recovered alcoholics. Hell I don't even drink. I just went to meetings to feel apart of the community, but those people are so f**ked. I'm a step up and doing well in life from walking away from all that bulshit. The same people with their same problems.ReplyDelete
I had 27 years dry when I took half a cocktail at a diner party just to officially divorce myself from the ignorance of AA. Been a few days now, I have 2 beers in the fridge been a month now, i dont care to drink them (but will if i want to), and had half a joint a month ago, nothing since. AA sucks and the people are getting more unfriendly by the day. Been in this town 20 years with intermittent AA attendance on my part and have not once been asked to sponsor, and have ZERO friends from AA. After meetings, I feel like a fish out of water, I try to get conversations going but feel left out all the time. No interest in being in a place I am not wanted.ReplyDelete
14 years away from alcohol,in AA.ReplyDelete
Agree with 1st half of 1st step,sober w/o big book.
No higher power for me.
AA really is dangerous ( for me). Ive been sober for 6 months but my days in"the program" are done. Ive been to hell and back. I find the slogans, the poorly written literature, most of the diminishing AA population, the steps, make me cringe and weep with rage. Its just a cult, plain and simple. Im only expressing my experience, I've found the strength and hope to be seriously lacking. I still take it day by day, so far, so good.ReplyDelete
I in no way believe alcoholics should sit around reminiscing about alcohol. Trying to live a life of sobriety revolved around alcohol. Which is exactly what AA asks of you.ReplyDelete
Just a bunch of egotistical drunks and druggies who couldn't manage their own lives, but now they're sober so they feel the need to "help" others by telling them where and when to be there and what they will or will not be doing! Excuse me, you couldn't manage you're own life but you expect me to let you speak to me like a2 year old, and give me ultimatums like if you don't stop smoking pot that you're doctor gave you because it's not a medicine, this is what I was just told, that I will be avoided like the plague because I'm a danger to their sobriety? The book clearly says I should listen to my doctor, it clearly says aa does not wish to engage in outside issues, it clearly says they are all inclusive never exclusive, and the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop "DRINKING", and don't give me no shit about you're not supposed to talk about drugs, first of all I wasn't i simply mentioned a medication I was taking prescribed by a doctor and peoples opinions got involved, feelings aren't facts ok, just because we were raised to believe marijuana is a dangerous drug it's not and all that crap we were taught is all lies, and second, drugs and medications are mentioned in the big book in the stories, so don't tell me I can't talk about shit that the original members got to talk about, hypocrites. 22 years in and out of those god forsaken rooms, i considered some of them family, im so done, and their own book does state that AA has no monopoly on sobriety, do not let them tell you it's the only way, please, and don't give up, i smoke a few bowls and this has been the best year I've had in over a decade, aa can piss the hell off.ReplyDelete
Very good. Humans are never going to get everything right. 23 years in AA myself and I see just how much that a troubled soul can want so badly to feel validation and to be valued that they will believe even their own lies. Really honestly fool themselves into a false sense of confidence that they have found the answer to life's problems in a formula. The Oxford group initially transcended from the principles of Jesus' brother James. Then it was mutated into the steps of as through Bill W sitting across the table from a man that had found God called Ebby who told him I found religion. Then a hundred problem drinkers converted the Oxford groups religious, Christian based steps into something "spiritual". 12 steps speaking of a God of your understanding... I sat in those rooms and listened to the trail souls of man speak about every conception of God that they were comfortable with or just no God (your choice) and talk of humility and honesty and the only way to truly appreciate those words and see just how hard they are to obtain is through the one guy they cannot stand to hear even be mentioned in a share. I've never heard a share. Just thousands and thousands of hours of ranting. Faith without deeds not faith without works. James words not mine. The brother of Jesus Christ! I am a putrid sinner and I left AA because even the how it works told me I was incapable of being honest with myself. Jesus is the only one who taught me to have grace upon myself. Because if God (Jesus' Father) can show me grace than I want to be close to Him. He died for me to prove His point. I am alive today only because of that gift. Ebby was the end of that grace and he doesn't even get a mention? Encouraging people when they are at their worst not turning your back on them because they are intoxicated. To serve not to sponsor! And if you aren't a chronic alcoholic/drug addict/gambler whatever you are but somebody who had some problems and then found somewhere you could bignote yourself for being able to stop (telling your truth as I heard many problem drinkers say) and you aren't chronic but an AA socialite. Than you need to go home and leave AA for the real alcoholics who come but don't stay long because they can't achieve what the fakes can. Yes you know who you are. Until you get out of your seat and leave and 'never come back' lol the opposite to 'keep coming back' the place will never work for the ones God designed it for. When you get Jesus you will see the truth. AA is not the place for real alcoholics because if you were one you would have left from the toxic shame and frustration of not being able to do what those problem drinkers all around you were doing. God bless those who are real chronic alcoholics or addicts or gamblers or all three. Jesus loves you. He died for us. Because His chosen people come to Him when they have spent too much time in hell. The hell right here. I hope you make it to the narrow gate at the end of a winding narrow path. That's where I belong. Home. Backpack Dave.ReplyDelete
To Unknown..... 23 years in AA and you're preaching Jesus Christ ??? Do you also administer the Eucharist at your meetings ?? And AA is not a religious cult ? Bill W is not worshipped as a deity?? Contradicting his words do not put you in damnation from the rooms of AA ?? You may deem me a dry drunk, but being happy and not drinking by my own decisions without following the directions of a group of pessimistic people seems to be working well one day at a time. If God gave you a gift, would you return it to Him and say you didn't want it. In the Book of Genesis, God gave man the gift of free will. In the 3rd step, we are giving our will back. That's not why God created us.ReplyDelete
I'm 30 days into AA. TBH I googled big egos in AA... found this article. Idk after doing 30 in 30 which is 30 aa meetings in 30 days I have noticed that AA has alot of ego maniacs in it.i got called on to share last night did a pretty good job despite not really wanting to share then listened as the next 3 people corrected me on the way I worded something in their own shares. Like I wasn't wrong to word what I did the way I did. Then the cherry on top was when it opened a discussion about pride not being a bad thing. I agree, it can be both good and bad.. the context I used it was bad.. All I said was my pride kept me from fixing things with someone in my life and bc I didn't get to I drank bc of it. Then a 10 minute discussion began about false pride vs pride and alot of stupid shit. Btw isn't pride on that list of 7 deadly sins? But I digress, I feel pissed off about all of that. It was just like they couldn't let me have my moment when it was mine wo somehow turning it in to something about themselves. I will keep going back bc I do have a months sobriety and I really don't want to drink. But I believe aa has alot of assholes in it who like to make everything about themselves.ReplyDelete
I dumped, fired, or whatever AA wants to call it, my sponsor. He told me that praying for other people's well being ir guidance is wrong because its asking God to change his plans. I told him he must have been using LSD with Bill Wilson (which he did in the 50's & 60's) !!! Then I told him goodbye.ReplyDelete
AA was great the first couple years of sobriety. Now I have my own life and rarely go to meetings. I feel uncomfortable and creeped out a lot. It seems like it is a place to hook up. Also, it is full of gossip and cliques. I have mixed feelings about it now. I have met a few awesome people, but most are wack jobs.ReplyDelete
Oh my God !!!! I went to the supermarket and they ran out of my favorite ice-cream!! Immediately I called my sponsor and he told me of the nearest meeting to get to as soon as possible !!!ReplyDelete
I tripped on my open shoelace .... oh no, something must be wrong with me... maybe I was thinking happy thoughts instead of concentrating on my defects of character. I must do a 10th step and see where I went wrong !!
My 9th step is till haunting me. When I was in 3rd grade I stole a bag of potato chips from Susan G's lunch box and made her cry. I've been searching for her to apologize. It's been over 40 years and might have to hire a private investigator in order to make amends or I might relapse. I knew my alcoholism was in full swing at that point because the prior year I made my first communion and had a sip of wine !!
In the Book of Genesis, God gave mankind the gift of free will. The 3rd step tells us to give it back and say "No thank you God. You created me with no intelligence and I can't make any decisions on my own. You can do everything for me. Take your gift back !!"
My sponsor's higher power is the big book. So a book is a power greater than himself ?? Who turns the pages ?? The book itself ?? Can he destroy it ??
Can't talk about drugs at a meeting but it's mentioned numerous times in the Big Book that two alcoholic drug addicts wrote. Dr. Bob was open about abusing drugs and our savior Bill experimented with LSD in the 1950's to see if he can get a spiritual experience. Oh, it was monitored by a physician..... B.S.- he wanted to get high.....probably with one of his mistresses.
Oh....in Mr. Wilson's will, he left a portion to one of his mistresses he was with while married to his wife. What a moral leader he was !! Let's bow and pray to him!!!
In conclusion, the whole AA thing is such an overrated crock of bull.